Beyond the Badge Finding Purpose and Joy After Policing

Paul Boomer: 00:00:10

Previously on Heroes Behind the Badge, we opened the door to a

Paul Boomer: 00:00:13

difficult truth, the weight our officers carry, and the cost of keeping it inside.

Paul Boomer: 00:00:18

In this episode, we move forward toward recovery purpose and the work of

Paul Boomer: 00:00:22

building a joyful life Beyond the Badge.

Paul Boomer: 00:00:25

Here's part two, beyond the badge, the path forward.

Craig Floyd: 00:00:29

That's- I wanna shift gears for just a moment.

Craig Floyd: 00:00:32

we know, uh, bill has adjusted very well to his

Craig Floyd: 00:00:36

post-law-enforcement career life, uh,

Bill Erfurth: 00:00:39

supposedly

Craig Floyd: 00:00:40

involved in so many great projects.

Craig Floyd: 00:00:42

Depends on who you talk, depends on who you talk about.

Craig Floyd: 00:00:44

Well, that's true.

Craig Floyd: 00:00:45

it's subject to subjective, but, I, wanna go to David Berez.

Craig Floyd: 00:00:51

Because one of the things that, Dave Howe's program a life plan,

Craig Floyd: 00:00:55

deals with is the transition mm-hmm.

Craig Floyd: 00:00:58

From either a military career to civilian life or a law enforcement

Craig Floyd: 00:01:03

career to civilian life.

Craig Floyd: 00:01:05

I mean, as we've alluded to a. That's your identity.

Craig Floyd: 00:01:09

for 20 or 30 years, you're a cop and with a gun and a badge, and you

Craig Floyd: 00:01:14

had all this authority and you could change people's lives in a second.

Craig Floyd: 00:01:19

and now you're a civilian with none of those powers.

Craig Floyd: 00:01:22

Your identity is lost.

Craig Floyd: 00:01:23

You don't wear a badge anymore, you don't carry a gun.

Craig Floyd: 00:01:26

Um, so David Berez.

Craig Floyd: 00:01:29

What was your transition from law enforcement career, 20 years to civilian

Craig Floyd: 00:01:35

life, and how did you deal with it?

David Berez: 00:01:39

Well, it was a bit tumultuous and I did not deal with it with grace.

David Berez: 00:01:43

so for me it was a bit of a, a rough go.

David Berez: 00:01:47

And when I left it 20 years, I thought I had the greatest plan on the planet.

David Berez: 00:01:52

I was gonna be a stay at home dad.

David Berez: 00:01:54

I was gonna just do everything with my kids, which is awesome, by the way.

David Berez: 00:01:58

I, I enjoy every moment with my family.

David Berez: 00:02:00

And if I needed to work or wanted to work, I was just gonna be a greeter at

David Berez: 00:02:04

Walmart and say, Hey, how you doing?

David Berez: 00:02:05

Here's your weekly flyer.

David Berez: 00:02:08

But you know what?

David Berez: 00:02:08

That's not how I'm programmed.

David Berez: 00:02:10

That's not how my brain works, how my body works.

David Berez: 00:02:13

That would not be enough stimulation for me.

David Berez: 00:02:17

I quickly learned that being a stay at home dad as honorable and as awesome as

David Berez: 00:02:20

that was, I needed more immediately and, but I had lost everything that I knew.

David Berez: 00:02:27

I lost the ability to be that community influencer through

David Berez: 00:02:30

the platform of policing.

David Berez: 00:02:32

I lost the ability to have a say in an organization that I wanted to

David Berez: 00:02:38

take in maybe a different direction.

David Berez: 00:02:40

I've lost the ability to have any sort of meaning or mattering in my life.

David Berez: 00:02:45

And therefore the other parts of that equation went away too.

David Berez: 00:02:49

What was I accomplishing?

David Berez: 00:02:50

What was my relationships like?

David Berez: 00:02:52

I had to rebuild my marriage.

David Berez: 00:02:55

I had to rebuild my relationship with my kids.

David Berez: 00:02:58

I've lost all of the positive emotion or that I, I should say, I never gained any

David Berez: 00:03:03

of the positive emotion that I thought I was going to get upon retirement.

David Berez: 00:03:06

So for me, that un that transition was, was not graceful.

David Berez: 00:03:11

I became depressive in a way that I didn't really see coming.

David Berez: 00:03:15

I thought it was gonna be a good thing, but it actually went the other way.

David Berez: 00:03:19

And I didn't realize how bad I was until July 29th when my

David Berez: 00:03:23

buddy Danny took his own life.

David Berez: 00:03:25

And let's look at the timeframe that we have COVID mixed in.

David Berez: 00:03:28

We have.

David Berez: 00:03:30

Uh, you know, the civil unrest had all had just begun a couple weeks before that,

David Berez: 00:03:34

uh, following the George Floyd stuff.

David Berez: 00:03:36

So the timing was, was wild.

David Berez: 00:03:39

But when Danny died, I realized, you know what?

David Berez: 00:03:42

That may have been me, if I didn't catch this.

David Berez: 00:03:45

So I caught myself as a result of his death, and I realized I needed to make a

David Berez: 00:03:50

transition that was beyond the transition from law enforcement to civilian life.

David Berez: 00:03:54

I needed to identify what my new needs, my new purpose was.

David Berez: 00:03:57

Finding your why is so important and that why cannot be attached to the uniform,

David Berez: 00:04:03

the badge, the gun, the status, the title.

David Berez: 00:04:06

So when we think about.

David Berez: 00:04:08

Rank when we think about the uniform, those positions don't belong to us.

David Berez: 00:04:13

We are stewards of them along the course of our career.

David Berez: 00:04:18

I don't care if you're a patrolman that for life or PFL as we used to

David Berez: 00:04:22

call them, or if you rise to the level of chief of police in a major, you

David Berez: 00:04:26

know, metropolitan area, Miami-Dade, New York City, Chicago, any of them,

David Berez: 00:04:29

that position does not belong to you.

David Berez: 00:04:31

That job, that badge.

David Berez: 00:04:33

That honor does not belong to you.

David Berez: 00:04:35

You are steward of it.

David Berez: 00:04:36

So when that is no longer yours, you need to find something else to put that energy

David Berez: 00:04:41

into, or you're gonna run into trouble.

David Berez: 00:04:43

And I think the idea of life planning before you get to that stage of

David Berez: 00:04:46

retirement is super important because you can identify what your purpose is.

David Berez: 00:04:51

Your purpose may be service to others, but how are you going to

David Berez: 00:04:54

do that without the badge, the uniform, and the gun, or the title?

David Berez: 00:04:58

Wow.

Craig Floyd: 00:04:59

Let me just say, David, that, uh, you have become incredibly purposeful,

Craig Floyd: 00:05:04

maybe more so than you were as a cop with the work you're doing, the book you

Craig Floyd: 00:05:08

wrote about resiliency and, and the, uh, training that you're giving other officers

Craig Floyd: 00:05:15

to deal with the stress of the job.

Craig Floyd: 00:05:17

Uh, you are literally saving lives, and, and I commend you for that, my friend.

Craig Floyd: 00:05:21

I, wanna turn though to Dave Howe.

Craig Floyd: 00:05:23

You've heard David Berez talk about the transition.

Craig Floyd: 00:05:26

It wasn't an easy one.

Craig Floyd: 00:05:27

You've seen it with yourself in your military career.

Craig Floyd: 00:05:30

You've seen other soldiers, uh, deal with it.

Craig Floyd: 00:05:33

how does a life plan help, address, the, transition from being a

Craig Floyd: 00:05:38

military officer or a law enforcement to officer to civilian life?

Craig Floyd: 00:05:44

Tell me about that.

Dave Howe: 00:05:47

Well, again, uh, having a life plan is good at all points in your life.

Dave Howe: 00:05:55

there are certain milestones in life where it can be the difference

Dave Howe: 00:05:59

between success and failure.

Dave Howe: 00:06:02

Beginning your life as an adult is a critical milestone.

Dave Howe: 00:06:06

Transitioning out of the military or out of law enforcement is a massive change,

Dave Howe: 00:06:11

and a lot of people end up literally losing their identity when they take

Dave Howe: 00:06:15

that uniform off for the last time.

Dave Howe: 00:06:18

So having a written plan in advance that is holistically looking at all of the

Dave Howe: 00:06:23

aspects that make for a joyful life.

Dave Howe: 00:06:25

So not just what are you gonna do, make money, but you know.

Dave Howe: 00:06:31

Make sure your relationships are all where they need to be.

Dave Howe: 00:06:34

Make sure you have some kind of way of tapping into some kind of inner spirit.

Dave Howe: 00:06:38

Um.

Dave Howe: 00:06:40

Obviously you need to be solid financially.

Dave Howe: 00:06:42

You know, you have all these different components that go

Dave Howe: 00:06:45

into what a successful, plan is.

Dave Howe: 00:06:48

And as you transition out of, a community like law enforcement, it really is

Dave Howe: 00:06:55

that much more important because unlike most of the civilian jobs, you know,

Dave Howe: 00:06:59

you were a shoe salesman for 20 years.

Dave Howe: 00:07:01

Okay?

Dave Howe: 00:07:02

We need shoe salespeople, but.

Dave Howe: 00:07:04

You're not suffering the same kind of loss of identity when you have sold your

Dave Howe: 00:07:10

last pair of shoes and you're moving on to whatever you're moving on to.

Dave Howe: 00:07:13

So this is a great way to make sure that people don't end up

Dave Howe: 00:07:18

in the situation that David has.

Dave Howe: 00:07:19

So, brilliantly described in his own life, where you suddenly literally start feeling

Dave Howe: 00:07:27

life is slipping away and you start.

Dave Howe: 00:07:29

You find yourself on a path that's, becoming darker and darker with each day.

Dave Howe: 00:07:34

And that's, that's ultimately how people end up, committing suicide is they

Dave Howe: 00:07:38

literally get to a point where living another day pain that is more painful

Dave Howe: 00:07:45

than the thought of ending their own life.

Dave Howe: 00:07:48

And that that's a truly, uh, difficult place for those that aren't.

Dave Howe: 00:07:55

Having any kind of suicidal thoughts to even understand much less,

Dave Howe: 00:07:59

uh, uh, see that something like that could happen to somebody.

Dave Howe: 00:08:02

But it happens in the law enforcement community, almost every two or

Dave Howe: 00:08:05

three days happens in the military community almost two dozen times a day.

Dave Howe: 00:08:11

So it, it's, it's, it's a very simple way of making sure you end up on the right

Dave Howe: 00:08:16

path rather than on a path that leads ultimately, uh, potentially to nowhere.

Bill Erfurth: 00:08:22

So Dave Howe, tell us, tell the audience we know, but.

Bill Erfurth: 00:08:27

Really put it in detail.

Bill Erfurth: 00:08:30

How are you bringing this together?

Bill Erfurth: 00:08:32

Who are you working with on this?

Bill Erfurth: 00:08:34

How is it going to be implemented?

Bill Erfurth: 00:08:37

Or how do you think the best possible way is to implement this, not only for

Bill Erfurth: 00:08:43

the military folks, which is where you started, but how it can it be integrated

Bill Erfurth: 00:08:49

into the law enforcement circles?

Dave Howe: 00:08:51

Sure.

Dave Howe: 00:08:52

So there's a lot, uh, to unpack in, in that question, but

Dave Howe: 00:08:55

I'll focus, uh, initially, on.

Dave Howe: 00:09:00

The best way, I believe, to bring this to, and it's the way I'm presenting

Dave Howe: 00:09:04

it to, uh, the members of Congress and members of the military to bring it,

Dave Howe: 00:09:09

uh, as part of the Transition Assistance Program, uh, for the military, is

Dave Howe: 00:09:14

to create sort of this opportunity.

Dave Howe: 00:09:17

It wouldn't be a formal program like what the military has

Dave Howe: 00:09:19

necessarily, but before you leave.

Dave Howe: 00:09:22

You've got your retirement papers in, or you've indicated that you're gonna go do

Dave Howe: 00:09:27

a different career, that this would be part of that process to make sure that

Dave Howe: 00:09:32

you are leaving on good terms, not so much with the department, but you're leaving

Dave Howe: 00:09:37

on good terms within your own self.

Dave Howe: 00:09:40

And one of the things that I would emphasize on the way that this

Dave Howe: 00:09:43

program needs to be implemented is it's designed for the family too.

Dave Howe: 00:09:48

because if your family is in support of.

Dave Howe: 00:09:52

What you're doing and they realize that there is light at the end of the

Dave Howe: 00:09:55

tunnel, whether it's a 20 year career or you're about to walk out the door

Dave Howe: 00:09:59

for the last time, you are gonna be in a much, much better place to deal

Dave Howe: 00:10:03

with that transition than if the family, the wife, wants to go one way.

Dave Howe: 00:10:07

The kids want to go another way and you're charging in off,

Dave Howe: 00:10:10

uh, in some other direction.

Dave Howe: 00:10:12

And I truly believe, 'cause the data supports it, that having a, a

Dave Howe: 00:10:17

life plan that brings in the family.

Dave Howe: 00:10:21

into that, crafting of the, the actual written document, you're gonna see

Dave Howe: 00:10:26

a, a much lower, uh, divorce rate.

Dave Howe: 00:10:29

You're gonna see a much lower incident rate of children

Dave Howe: 00:10:33

acting, and obviously the,

Dave Howe: 00:10:38

in a much place, emotionally, mentally, financially, every other way, by

Dave Howe: 00:10:44

having a written plan that's out there, uh, that they can look at.

Craig Floyd: 00:10:48

David Berez somebody.

Craig Floyd: 00:10:49

And if an officer though, uh, just to finish that point, if an officer

Craig Floyd: 00:10:53

individually or a department, maybe a chief or sheriff wanted to, implement such

Craig Floyd: 00:11:00

a program, wanted or to develop a life plan within their own department or within

Craig Floyd: 00:11:05

their own lives, who can they contact?

Craig Floyd: 00:11:08

Uh, give us some.

Craig Floyd: 00:11:09

Is there some person yourself perhaps that they should go to or your organization?

Dave Howe: 00:11:17

Yes, actually, um, the, uh, best way to get additional

Dave Howe: 00:11:22

information is to just send me a simple email at, daveHowe@kenrusk.com.

Dave Howe: 00:11:29

Ken Rusk is the, uh, architect of the program.

Dave Howe: 00:11:33

Uh, he created it, uh, not for the topic that we're talking about

Dave Howe: 00:11:37

today, you know, mental health and suicide prevention and so forth.

Dave Howe: 00:11:40

He created it, uh, when his young daughter.

Dave Howe: 00:11:43

Uh, was going through a case of melanoma, uh, while she,

Dave Howe: 00:11:51

and he wanted to.

Dave Howe: 00:11:55

To leave her a roadmap so that she could continue, uh, assuming she

Dave Howe: 00:11:59

survived, uh, a very serious illness, she could have a successful life.

Dave Howe: 00:12:04

And that was the thing that was the catalyst that created this

Dave Howe: 00:12:07

program in the first place.

Dave Howe: 00:12:08

So again, it, it's program is not focused to make people that have

Dave Howe: 00:12:12

mental health problems better, that is merely a additional benefit

Dave Howe: 00:12:16

of people way earlier in life.

Dave Howe: 00:12:20

Developing the, plan to make sure that they're really squeezing

Dave Howe: 00:12:25

every drop of joy that they can out of their time on this earth.

Dave Howe: 00:12:30

and if when you're doing that, you end up having a life that looks very much

Dave Howe: 00:12:33

like, uh, Bill Erfurth rather than people that, uh, we all know that, if,

Dave Howe: 00:12:40

if they won a million dollars, they'd complain that it wasn't 2 million.

Dave Howe: 00:12:43

The glass half empty people, uh, are really the ones who,

Dave Howe: 00:12:47

this isn't a negotiable thing.

Dave Howe: 00:12:49

They really need to have a written plan for how to get

Dave Howe: 00:12:51

back into a joyful existence.

Dave Howe: 00:12:53

Wow.

Dave Howe: 00:12:54

Um, those that are the half full kind of people, this is a nice to have

Dave Howe: 00:12:58

thing that really ensures they are getting every last drop of gusto,

Dave Howe: 00:13:02

uh, that they can out of, uh, however much time they have left on earth.

Bill Erfurth: 00:13:07

So maybe we can drop your email into, uh, into

Bill Erfurth: 00:13:10

the podcast here at the end so people can see it and reference it.

Bill Erfurth: 00:13:15

David Berez.

Bill Erfurth: 00:13:16

So you heard what Dave said.

Bill Erfurth: 00:13:19

I know what both of you have been talking about.

Bill Erfurth: 00:13:24

tell the audience, tell the police chiefs, tell the police administrators

Bill Erfurth: 00:13:27

out there, how do we implement this?

Bill Erfurth: 00:13:29

How does this happen?

David Berez: 00:13:32

So I think it needs to come from leadership.

David Berez: 00:13:35

There has to be buy-in from the top to understand that there are ways to

David Berez: 00:13:41

satisfy your, the people that work for you to be able to give you the best.

David Berez: 00:13:47

Nobody.

David Berez: 00:13:48

Leaves their job because of money.

David Berez: 00:13:50

Nobody leaves their job because they don't like the work they're doing.

David Berez: 00:13:54

People of most often leave their jobs because leadership is terrible.

David Berez: 00:13:57

So if you can show your people that you care, which is what leadership is all

David Berez: 00:14:01

about, there's a distinct difference between being a leader and being a boss.

David Berez: 00:14:05

If you're just a boss of your agency.

David Berez: 00:14:07

This is gonna be troubling for you to to implement because nobody's

David Berez: 00:14:10

gonna have the respect for you that this means something to you.

David Berez: 00:14:13

So if you are a leader of your agency and you implement an amazing program like this

David Berez: 00:14:18

where you're showing that you care for your people, which is what leadership is

David Berez: 00:14:21

all about, leadership is not about you.

David Berez: 00:14:23

Leadership is not about your title.

David Berez: 00:14:25

It's about how you show up for your people.

David Berez: 00:14:27

And if you implement a program like this for your people,

David Berez: 00:14:30

they will get that from you.

David Berez: 00:14:32

They will get that you care about them.

David Berez: 00:14:33

They will get that.

David Berez: 00:14:34

Caring for you is the best thing for the agency.

David Berez: 00:14:38

So yes, if we put leadership in a place where they embrace this and

David Berez: 00:14:43

lead by example and do a program like this for themselves as well.

David Berez: 00:14:47

'cause I don't care what kind of stars, bars, or whatever you got

David Berez: 00:14:49

on your shoulder, if you're not doing it by example, nobody's

David Berez: 00:14:53

going to trust your authenticity.

David Berez: 00:14:56

So get in there with your people, lead by example.

David Berez: 00:14:59

Show them that at any stage in your life.

David Berez: 00:15:01

Having a life plan will only make the rest of your life better no matter where, what

David Berez: 00:15:05

point you start from and bring it down.

David Berez: 00:15:08

Let the youngest guy or the youngest girl in your department be part of that with

David Berez: 00:15:12

you and show them the path, model the behavior you wanna see from your people.

David Berez: 00:15:16

And it starts with giving people a good life.

Bill Erfurth: 00:15:19

Well, what do you need?

Bill Erfurth: 00:15:21

What what?

Bill Erfurth: 00:15:22

do you need to get behind this?

Bill Erfurth: 00:15:23

Do you need sponsors?

Bill Erfurth: 00:15:25

Do you need money?

Bill Erfurth: 00:15:27

What do you need?

Bill Erfurth: 00:15:29

Money's important, Dave, right?

Dave Howe: 00:15:31

Oh, absolutely.

Dave Howe: 00:15:32

yeah.

Dave Howe: 00:15:32

And actually, uh, well, again, the program is designed for every

Dave Howe: 00:15:36

member of, uh, the law enforcement community to include family members.

Dave Howe: 00:15:41

there are lots of money that are, I know are out there because I

Dave Howe: 00:15:45

know they're definitely there in the military, uh, community.

Dave Howe: 00:15:49

Or suicide prevention, mental health issues, wellness programs.

Dave Howe: 00:15:54

Um, and there are probably other buckets of money that are available

Dave Howe: 00:15:58

at the local, state and federal level.

Dave Howe: 00:16:00

So that, that's one funding source.

Dave Howe: 00:16:04

there's also the foundation, uh, which we're trying to, uh, uh.

Dave Howe: 00:16:09

Put a campaign together so we can get the funds necessary to provide

Dave Howe: 00:16:14

this program free of charge to those families that suffer that worst day when

Dave Howe: 00:16:20

their loved one goes to work as a law enforcement officer and doesn't come home.

Dave Howe: 00:16:24

So subject to the availability of funds, we would like to be able to provide

Dave Howe: 00:16:28

the program free of charge, where people from our uh, organization would

Dave Howe: 00:16:33

literally be part of the grief management.

Dave Howe: 00:16:36

Scheme, whatever that looks like for that particular, uh, law enforcement agency,

Dave Howe: 00:16:42

we would plug into and support their efforts to support that family so that

Dave Howe: 00:16:47

they can take that horrible, negative energy, you know, what do we do now?

Dave Howe: 00:16:51

And turn that into how they can truly envision positive life moving

Dave Howe: 00:16:56

forward that their deceased loved one would want them to have and not

Dave Howe: 00:17:00

get stuck in the grieving process.

Dave Howe: 00:17:03

I haven't really heard

Bill Erfurth: 00:17:04

yet how you plan on this being presented.

Bill Erfurth: 00:17:07

Is this gonna be in service training at a police academy?

Bill Erfurth: 00:17:11

At at the police headquarters?

Bill Erfurth: 00:17:13

It gonna be conferences, conventions.

Bill Erfurth: 00:17:15

Talk about that.

Dave Howe: 00:17:17

Basically just like no cops, no two cops are the same.

Dave Howe: 00:17:21

No two organization law enforcement organizations are the same.

Dave Howe: 00:17:25

So the program is very customizable to fit the particular needs and

Dave Howe: 00:17:31

operations of a particular department.

Dave Howe: 00:17:34

So there is no one size fit all, but it ranges everything from an online

Dave Howe: 00:17:38

version, which I actually don't recommend because what I've seen is.

Dave Howe: 00:17:45

The people that do well with the online course are the billers first of the world.

Dave Howe: 00:17:50

So yeah, their life becomes maybe a little bit better, but they were gonna,

Dave Howe: 00:17:54

they were gonna do really well anyway.

Dave Howe: 00:17:56

People that really, really need this are the ones that probably aren't

Dave Howe: 00:18:01

gonna get through a self-paced on your own, no outside accountability.

Dave Howe: 00:18:07

And you just sort of give them an online access.

Dave Howe: 00:18:10

And they hope, and hope that they make it all the way through and

Dave Howe: 00:18:12

come up with a, a role viable plan that they're gonna commit to.

Dave Howe: 00:18:17

So the way we recommend doing this is for an organization, uh,

Dave Howe: 00:18:21

department to contract with us.

Dave Howe: 00:18:23

We figure out what the right way is to do it, but mostly it's probably

Dave Howe: 00:18:27

going to involve a train the trainer model that I take from the military,

Dave Howe: 00:18:32

background that I have, which is we would come in, the department would

Dave Howe: 00:18:35

identify one or more super, uh, users that would then become the trainers for.

Dave Howe: 00:18:41

Future members of the department, we could do the initial training

Dave Howe: 00:18:44

at the same time so that you get a cohort of law enforcement officers

Dave Howe: 00:18:50

through the program at one time.

Dave Howe: 00:18:53

But then the plan would be we would take one step back, leave the train

Dave Howe: 00:18:57

the trainers there to, to train people as they come into the department and

Dave Howe: 00:19:01

or as they're leaving the department.

Dave Howe: 00:19:02

Whenever you think the critical milestones it are for that

Dave Howe: 00:19:06

particular, uh, agency and then we.

Dave Howe: 00:19:11

Provide quality control to the trainers to make sure that they're

Dave Howe: 00:19:15

providing the instruction exactly the same way that our people would do it.

Dave Howe: 00:19:19

And most importantly, we would review a number of the plans to make sure that

Dave Howe: 00:19:24

we're seeing the kind of quality that needs to be there for the plan to really

Dave Howe: 00:19:27

have the lifelong, support that the plans are decided, designed to provide.

Dave Howe: 00:19:36

You know, the plans are, are.

Dave Howe: 00:19:39

Written, but they're also designed to be updated as things in your life change.

Dave Howe: 00:19:44

So it's not a static thing where you do it, you know, when you're 20 something

Dave Howe: 00:19:48

years old, first day on the job, and that plan looks exactly the same 30

Dave Howe: 00:19:53

years later when you're walking out of the department for the last time.

Dave Howe: 00:19:57

There's a lot of interaction that needs to go on to make the plan a living

Dave Howe: 00:20:01

document, which is where you really get, the return on the investment or.

Dave Howe: 00:20:07

Putting a program like this into place, and Dave, lemme say, so train the trainer

Dave Howe: 00:20:11

is really the right way to do this.

Craig Floyd: 00:20:13

I have, um, had a discussion with Dave Howe about

Craig Floyd: 00:20:16

how we can maybe help amplify, uh, the availability of this program.

Craig Floyd: 00:20:20

And I'm gonna be, uh, sending it out to the State associations of

Craig Floyd: 00:20:23

Chiefs of Police, the state Sheriff's associations across this country, and

Craig Floyd: 00:20:28

encourage them to share this program, availability to their membership.

Craig Floyd: 00:20:33

So hopefully we citizens behind the badge.

Craig Floyd: 00:20:36

We'll be able to help get the word out.

Craig Floyd: 00:20:38

And in closing, Dennis, I wanna pass it on to you, but let me just say

Craig Floyd: 00:20:42

that, uh, Dave, how hit on something interesting, he said, there's a lot of

Craig Floyd: 00:20:47

officers like Bill Erfurth and I would suggest the overwhelming majority of

Craig Floyd: 00:20:51

officers who probably end their career.

Craig Floyd: 00:20:53

On a high note, they feel like they've accomplished something very,

Craig Floyd: 00:20:57

uh, honorable, having served, uh, in the law enforcement profession, and

Craig Floyd: 00:21:01

they go on to lead wonderful lives.

Craig Floyd: 00:21:04

and this program will just make it that much easier for them, that much

Craig Floyd: 00:21:08

better for them, uh, than it already is.

Craig Floyd: 00:21:11

And yet there are officers who are struggling, and this would be a minority,

Craig Floyd: 00:21:16

of the officer population, I would suggest having met so many of them.

Craig Floyd: 00:21:21

But, uh, we need to make these types of programs positive

Craig Floyd: 00:21:25

psychology, uh, resiliency training.

Craig Floyd: 00:21:28

Uh, life plan.

Craig Floyd: 00:21:29

Uh, those are important tools in making sure that our officers, uh, get through

Craig Floyd: 00:21:34

their careers healthy and well, and, have a great life afterwards, a joyful life.

Craig Floyd: 00:21:39

So, uh, thank you David and Dave for sharing all of this with us.

Craig Floyd: 00:21:43

And Dennis, I'll turn it over to you to close.

Dennis Collins: 00:21:47

Thank you, Craig.

Dennis Collins: 00:21:48

I can't wait to get the transcript to this episode.

Dennis Collins: 00:21:51

You guys drop gold nuggets all throughout this, episode.

Dennis Collins: 00:21:56

And I, I, I, our listeners and viewers can get the transcript as well along

Dennis Collins: 00:22:01

with, when they view this or listen to it, please get the transcript and look at it.

Dennis Collins: 00:22:07

There are gold nuggets throughout from these two gentlemen.

Dennis Collins: 00:22:11

I just have one more question.

Dennis Collins: 00:22:13

A lot of police chiefs, a lot of sheriffs, a lot of, police management,

Dennis Collins: 00:22:19

law enforcement, management have this little phrase that they use.

Dennis Collins: 00:22:24

I want your opinion on this.

Dennis Collins: 00:22:26

It's okay not to be okay.

Dennis Collins: 00:22:29

I hear that from our sheriffs here in Florida.

Dennis Collins: 00:22:32

I've heard of from police chiefs around the nation.

Dennis Collins: 00:22:35

They do little videos for their troops.

Dennis Collins: 00:22:39

For the guys, David, the two, Davids particularly and perhaps

Dennis Collins: 00:22:44

Miller for can weigh in on this.

Dennis Collins: 00:22:46

Is it okay to not be okay in policing today?

David Berez: 00:22:52

I'll, I'll just, I'll tackle that real quick and say, yes,

David Berez: 00:22:54

it's okay to not be okay if you're going to get the support to be okay.

David Berez: 00:22:58

I would add to that it's also okay to be okay.

David Berez: 00:23:02

We don't have to be victims all the time.

David Berez: 00:23:04

Correct.

David Berez: 00:23:05

We can be in good shape.

David Berez: 00:23:06

We can be the best version of, we should be the best version of ourselves for our.

David Berez: 00:23:12

Agencies for our communities, and most importantly for our families at home.

David Berez: 00:23:16

That's where we need to be, is for our families at home.

David Berez: 00:23:19

The job is a job.

David Berez: 00:23:20

It's a good one.

David Berez: 00:23:20

It's an important one.

David Berez: 00:23:21

Our communities depend on us, but it's okay to be okay and if you're

David Berez: 00:23:25

not, figure out how to get there.

David Berez: 00:23:28

There are avenues, there are programs, but it's okay to not be okay, but only

David Berez: 00:23:33

if you're gonna do something about it.

David Berez: 00:23:34

If you're not doing anything about it, it's time to go.

Dennis Collins: 00:23:36

We talked earlier about the stigma.

Dennis Collins: 00:23:39

Bill Orford talked about that.

Dennis Collins: 00:23:41

We all discussed that.

Dennis Collins: 00:23:43

is there still a stigma to not be okay?

Dennis Collins: 00:23:46

Are you in fear of your job?

Dennis Collins: 00:23:48

Are you in fear of, uh, your reputation, et cetera?

Dennis Collins: 00:23:52

Is there still that stigma?

David Berez: 00:23:55

Uh, either I would say, I would say yes.

David Berez: 00:23:57

but I would also add that.

David Berez: 00:24:00

The leadership has a responsibility to make sure that what you have

David Berez: 00:24:05

is not going to be a problem for the agency or the community.

David Berez: 00:24:08

Absolutely.

David Berez: 00:24:08

Uh,

Dennis Collins: 00:24:09

and this ties back, uh, Dave Howe, uh, about leadership.

Dennis Collins: 00:24:13

This goes back to leadership.

Dennis Collins: 00:24:15

We talked about this a lot during this episode.

Dennis Collins: 00:24:18

Yeah,

Dave Howe: 00:24:19

absolutely.

Dave Howe: 00:24:21

A program like the, uh, Program to develop a joyful life, plan of action,

Dave Howe: 00:24:28

it has to have the support of the senior leadership, for a number of reasons.

Dave Howe: 00:24:32

One, they have to emotionally believe in this or otherwise no one belong.

Dave Howe: 00:24:37

I mean, you can force people to sit and get another death by PowerPoint

Dave Howe: 00:24:41

experience, uh, uh, that I'm sure they're being subjected to all the times

Dave Howe: 00:24:46

on a wide range of ridiculous topics.

Dave Howe: 00:24:51

And, and in which case it's a waste of everybody's time.

Dave Howe: 00:24:55

This, actually can be a total game changer in so many ways.

Dave Howe: 00:24:58

I mean, everything from, you'll have not just better law enforcement officers,

Dave Howe: 00:25:03

but you'll have better law enforcement families to community does well.

Dave Howe: 00:25:07

The retirement community will be in better shape.

Dave Howe: 00:25:11

and you can actually see by finding an avenue.

Dave Howe: 00:25:16

Of creating a positive plan forward to get rid of a lot of that stress

Dave Howe: 00:25:21

that oftentimes leads to officer involved incidents, which when the

Dave Howe: 00:25:25

lawyers hear that, they're like, yeah, if I can bend the, the cost

Dave Howe: 00:25:29

curve of lawsuits and other, legal.

Dave Howe: 00:25:34

Trouble, through something like this, you know, it, it's a huge return

Dave Howe: 00:25:40

on the investment of the time and whatever money it might take to,

Dave Howe: 00:25:43

to implement a program like this.

Dave Howe: 00:25:47

Excellent, excellent.

Bill Erfurth: 00:25:47

So, Dave Berez, we're talking about things that are okay.

Bill Erfurth: 00:25:52

It is okay for you to go ahead and promote your book.

Bill Erfurth: 00:25:54

So why don't you hold your book up for everybody?

Dennis Collins: 00:25:58

What a segue.

Dennis Collins: 00:25:59

What a segue,

David Berez: 00:26:03

self-promotion for me is actually not very easy, so I

David Berez: 00:26:05

appreciate you putting that out there.

David Berez: 00:26:07

Then I'll do it.

David Berez: 00:26:08

A resilient

Dennis Collins: 00:26:09

life, A cop's journey of Pursuit and Purpose, A Resilient Life

Dennis Collins: 00:26:14

by David Berez, B-E-R-E-Z, Berez, right?

David Berez: 00:26:18

That's it.

David Berez: 00:26:19

Uh, no thank you for, for doing that.

David Berez: 00:26:20

It's, uh, it's.

David Berez: 00:26:22

It's my life story and the tools I've used to overcome some of, some of the things

David Berez: 00:26:26

that have encountered throughout my life.

David Berez: 00:26:28

Uh, it ends before I actually got my education in all of this.

David Berez: 00:26:33

So I think somewhere along the line, there may be a part two,

David Berez: 00:26:36

but Sounds like the sequels.

David Berez: 00:26:38

Yeah.

David Berez: 00:26:38

We'll see.

David Berez: 00:26:39

But yeah, it's, uh, I, I appreciate you putting that out there.

David Berez: 00:26:41

It means a lot

Craig Floyd: 00:26:41

me say I've read it.

Craig Floyd: 00:26:43

I read it before it was even published.

Craig Floyd: 00:26:45

Uh, I was given that honor.

Craig Floyd: 00:26:47

It is powerful, it is riveting, and it is courageous.

Craig Floyd: 00:26:51

Uh, he put himself out there.

Craig Floyd: 00:26:54

you, you know everything about David Berez when you finish this book.

Craig Floyd: 00:26:57

Uh, the good, the bad, and the ugly.

Craig Floyd: 00:27:00

And uh, and he's using it for a good purpose now as he, um, serves

Craig Floyd: 00:27:04

as a master resiliency trainer.

Craig Floyd: 00:27:07

God bless you, David.

Dennis Collins: 00:27:10

It's authentic.

Dennis Collins: 00:27:11

It's, it's real.

Dennis Collins: 00:27:12

It's not some, uh, performative bullshit.

Dennis Collins: 00:27:15

It's real.

David Berez: 00:27:16

So Craig and, and Dennis, thank you for mentioning that.

David Berez: 00:27:18

I appreciate that.

David Berez: 00:27:19

Uh, what I would add is, Craig, you have mentioned to me over the course

David Berez: 00:27:23

of our time since the book has come out about your shock on how I forgot

David Berez: 00:27:28

how to love and I learned how to ReLove, following my experiences.

David Berez: 00:27:32

And I would say love is the most important.

David Berez: 00:27:34

Thing that we do in life.

David Berez: 00:27:36

And if we forget how to do that, everything else begins to fall apart.

David Berez: 00:27:41

Uh, so a program that Dave is talking about with building all of these life

David Berez: 00:27:45

skills gives us the ability to focus on how we love each other because we're

David Berez: 00:27:50

not so concentrated on the little things that this life skill program will be

David Berez: 00:27:55

able to build for us naturally, where these things become natural for us.

David Berez: 00:27:59

So if we can have those items work for us, we can f. Get back to

David Berez: 00:28:05

loving each other in a way I don't think we're all doing right now.

David Berez: 00:28:09

And it, I know it sounds a little hinky, a little corny, whatever,

David Berez: 00:28:12

but the um, ability to build those relationships is so important because

David Berez: 00:28:17

that in the end is what matters.

David Berez: 00:28:19

Who cares how much money you made?

David Berez: 00:28:21

Who cares what your title was?

David Berez: 00:28:23

It's irrelevant if you don't have those relationships in

David Berez: 00:28:26

your life that support you.

David Berez: 00:28:27

And building a program like Dave is, is talking about, gives us the

David Berez: 00:28:30

ability to get back to those basics.

Dennis Collins: 00:28:33

Well said.

Dennis Collins: 00:28:34

And if you want more about, uh, the program that Dave is working with, uh,

Dennis Collins: 00:28:40

the entrepreneur is named Ken Rusk, RUSK.

Dennis Collins: 00:28:43

Did I get that right?

Dennis Collins: 00:28:44

Ken Rusk.

Dennis Collins: 00:28:45

you got that right.

Dennis Collins: 00:28:46

And book.

Dennis Collins: 00:28:47

This is

Dave Howe: 00:28:48

his book.

Dave Howe: 00:28:48

Blue Collar Cash.

Dave Howe: 00:28:50

Blue Collar, which is a terrible title.

Dave Howe: 00:28:52

Yes.

Dave Howe: 00:28:52

And it's very confusing about, we've been talking about, uh, today.

Dave Howe: 00:28:58

Um, but.

Dave Howe: 00:29:00

he really wrote two books.

Dave Howe: 00:29:02

One is the virtues of blue collar work versus having to Go to College.

Dave Howe: 00:29:06

But mo half the book is a, a step-by-step description of how to craft your own,

Dave Howe: 00:29:13

uh, holistic plan for a joyful life.

Dennis Collins: 00:29:17

Good.

Dennis Collins: 00:29:17

And you can pick that up wherever books are sold.

Dennis Collins: 00:29:19

And, uh, I, have done a little deep dive on that since meeting, uh, Dave

Dennis Collins: 00:29:26

yesterday, and it's worth the dive.

Dennis Collins: 00:29:28

So guys, we could go on and on.

Dennis Collins: 00:29:31

I appreciate your being so vulnerable and transparent and so forthcoming.

Dennis Collins: 00:29:37

With ideas on this very, very difficult subject.

Dennis Collins: 00:29:41

Uh, I know that what Dave Howe does is more than just dealing with

Dennis Collins: 00:29:44

police suicides, but I think that, I think Dave Berez would even agree

Dennis Collins: 00:29:49

that is part of what has to happen and the blend between the positive

Dennis Collins: 00:29:55

psychology and resiliency and a life plan, that's where the magic happens.

Dennis Collins: 00:30:00

Happens, and that's the word that we as citizens behind the badge must spread.

Dennis Collins: 00:30:05

Let me remind everyone, number one, thanks for listening.

Dennis Collins: 00:30:08

Thanks for watching.

Dennis Collins: 00:30:10

this podcast, Heroes Behind the Badge is sponsored by Citizens Behind the Badge,

Dennis Collins: 00:30:15

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Dennis Collins: 00:30:17

In support of the men and women of law enforcement, you can get

Dennis Collins: 00:30:22

involved right now by going to Citizens Behind the badge.org.

Dennis Collins: 00:30:27

Or some people will just say org, right?

Dennis Collins: 00:30:29

Citizens behind the badge.org, and you can, contribute.

Dennis Collins: 00:30:35

You can get involved, you can show your support.

Dennis Collins: 00:30:39

Hundreds of thousands of your fellow Americans have already done so.

Dennis Collins: 00:30:43

We would love to add your name to the list of people who are actively supporting law

Dennis Collins: 00:30:48

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Dennis Collins: 00:30:51

And if you'd like, anything you heard today from the Daves.

Dennis Collins: 00:30:55

Okay.

Dennis Collins: 00:30:55

Anything you heard?

Dennis Collins: 00:30:56

We do us a favor.

Dennis Collins: 00:30:58

Hit follow.

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Dennis Collins: 00:31:01

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Hit 'em all.

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We'd love to have you as a loyal follower, fan, subscriber, and

Dennis Collins: 00:31:11

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Dennis Collins: 00:31:18

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Dennis Collins: 00:31:22

That's all for today's episode of Heroes Behind the Badge.

Dennis Collins: 00:31:26

Thank you, Davids, and we'll see you next time on Heroes Behind the Badge.